Will Bower's Millions of Dollars myth DEBUNKED.
Now, this doesn't come to a shock to me.. because I have known this pretty much the entire time. But Will Bowers has to be a pretty opportunistic glamazon to boast on national television that he and his cronies of millions had what it took to raise such a whopping grand total of ten million dollars. All in the name of "retiring hillary's debt." I called bull from the moment I saw that on youtube, but hey, I'm just a girl with a blog and good B.S detector, so I needed something more.
Remember this on youtube:
Now, I don't want Hillary in debt. But I also don't want others who were thinking of donating to NOT donate because Bowers' lies and his claim that PUMA already paid it off.
Though, the more I think of it, the more I realize that this was probably their goal... because then they would still have something to scream and shout about. How the DNC left her in debt.
So, today- when this story was sent to me, I couldn't help but laugh, become a little sad, and consider the "millions of dollars" myth to be officially DEBUNKED. Suck on it Bowers!!
I will believe a spokesperson for the Hillary Clinton campaign over some "off the bus" blogger any day!
Their words:
As far as we know, that $10 million is a fallacy. We have not seen that money. It is our understanding that these groups provide links to our website, and there is no way to track which sites those donations come from. We have received no donations from the PAC
Want to see what they think of PUMA? Click to read the rest of the story.
Good evening kool-aid drinking Obamabots.
Just thought I’d drop by to share with you our response to Don Fowler and Alice Germond’s letter.
First, their ridiculous letter:
[Subject: Shut up and fall in line]
Dear Democratic Friends:
2008 is a Democratic year-at all levels in all the states. The opportunity is ours. We just have to seize it. We experienced an exciting, intense, sometimes difficult, campaign to nominate our presidential candidate. Now it’s over. Barack Obama won. I supported Hillary Clinton and am proud and pleased that I did. But she lost. Barack Obama won. It’s over. It is time for all Democrats, supporters of Senator Clinton and all other contenders for the nomination, to stand with him to secure his election and the election of Democrats at all levels of competition. I must confess a bit of fatigue and irritation with people who continue to carp, complain, and criticize the results of the primary and lay down conditions for their support. The Los Angeles Lakers didn’t establish conditions to recognize the Boston Celtics as NBA Champions; Roger Federer did not demand concessions before recognizing that Rafael Nadal defeated him at Wimbledon. It is time to act in a mature and resourceful fashion. It’s time to put the primaries behind us. It’s time to support Barack Obama without conditions or demands. It’s time to WIN for Barack Obama, the Democratic Party, America, and our future. We have an unparalleled opportunity. I hope we will all do everything we can to seize the moment.
See you at the Inauguration.
Sincerely,
Don Fowler
DNC Member At-Large, South Carolina
Former Chair of the Democratic National Committee
Alice Germond
Secretary, Democratic National Committee
Posted by: Knoxville | July 21, 2008 at 07:53 PM
And now our response:
Subject: We hear you
Dear Mr. Fowler and Ms. Germond,
Thank you for letting us know that our efforts to protest the 2008 presidential election – the carping, the complaining, and the criticizing, as you put it – are having the desired effect.
And thank you for using ridiculous and completely inapt sports analogies to support your opinions, as they prove our point about just how badly you, the Democratic Party’s leaders – who have once again confirmed that you understand nothing of the meaning of representative democracy or the significance of our core democratic principles –, have failed us.
The situation we’re all in was the result of your inappropriate actions and inactions, not ours. So let the division of the party that has failed us all so badly begin.
Sincerely,
NFIL Voter/Democrat
www.NotFallingInLine.org
Posted by: Knoxville | July 21, 2008 at 07:56 PM
Knoxille is the epitome of a troll.
Posted by: Christina | July 21, 2008 at 07:58 PM
Hey Knoxville, you were laughed out of the room yesterday, not only here but over at the puma blog as well. Do you really think we're going to suddenly be impressed that you've learned how to cut and paste?
Meanwhile, let me save the other pumas the effort: "Those numbers were from June for heckity heck's sake!"
Posted by: Pumalicious! | July 21, 2008 at 08:01 PM
What is a troll, exactly? I thought that you, Christina, pride yourself on this blog being an open forum. How can there be a troll in an open forum?
I was laughed out of the room yesterday? Well, you should all be proud of yourselves for hurting my feelings.
Keep up the good work!
You're helping us to divide the disgraceful and undemocratic Democratic Party and to throw out the Democratic Party's losership.
www.NotFallingInLine.org
Posted by: Knoxville | July 21, 2008 at 09:19 PM
open forums have nothing to do with trolling. Trolling is going to a site that you don't like and posting irrelevant comments. You are that.
And Pumalicious didn't hurt your feelings, you came here to post how you are helping divide the party with your letter. What do you expect? kisses on the cheek?
Posted by: Christina | July 21, 2008 at 10:04 PM
Who knows who these PUMA people are or what their motivation is. The majority could be Republicans for all we know. Hillary has obviously disowned them. And if the majority of them are Democrat women and voting for McCain, then they're only voting against their own best interests. Here's Hillary again trying to stand up for Democratic values in trying to stop Bush's HHS from labeling birth control methods "abortion". She could use PUMAs support in this and on all matters relating to women and health care. And that means voting Democrat. Do they think McCain won't support Bush's position? Of course he will.
Posted by: Bruce | July 21, 2008 at 10:09 PM
Knoxville,
You may want to take this little piece of info back to your cult leader .....
http://www.reuters.com/article/politicsNews/idUSN3038963020080701
I doubt she will post that on her her site.
Posted by: pumabot | July 21, 2008 at 10:33 PM
Good evening Knoxille how are you? How does it feel to be in an open forum where free speech lives on. In pumaland you are held back as to what you can and can not say, my but that seems VERY undemocratic. But then again we are talking about puma they plan to be the ruination of all that is Democratic. I must say I dig your letter really I'm more then sure many a delete button will be pushed today.
Back to the subject really how can people believe anything that comes out of Will Bowers mouth? They need to listen to this YouTube vid. again, listen to the dates, he said the week leading up to the 4th of July they raised 10 million. Not to mention the smug look on his face when saying we (jsnd) don't need Senator Obama. ARE YOU KIDDING ME...our nominee continues to raise funds to pay Hillary's debt. You people are doing NOTHING but killing Hillary's good name and it is sickening. Why do you think she wants NOTHING to do with you??
And Knoxville comes here and posts a fill in the blanks email...what you have nothing to say Knoxville?? You have no rebuttal at all? The best you can do is post this dribble that means nothing. Again the puma mentality at it's best. And you are so classless with your greeting, oh my what would your mamapuma think? BTW I am a Hillary supporter, but the more you people were acting as if you had anything to do with her my support as well as many, many others was wavering. THANK GOD YOU ARE OUT, her good name is SAVED from your claws.
Posted by: Wendy~Dem4life | July 21, 2008 at 10:58 PM
Now that would have been a wonderful thing considering we all want to see Sen. Clinton debt free but come on, how many groups are they donating to at the same time. We have felines donating to puma, jsnd, denver group etc. I mean if you all are that rich why didn't you just give all that money to Sen. Clinton before the end of the primary season.
Posted by: HillaryClinton4BarackObama | July 21, 2008 at 10:58 PM
Great comments Wendy and Hill.
Knoxville is a putz, and his site sux ass.
Posted by: pumabot | July 21, 2008 at 11:27 PM
I was laughed out of the room yesterday?
I guess Knoxville missed my haiku. :(
Posted by: Kevin K. | July 21, 2008 at 11:27 PM
Lmao Kevin,
I had to cook dinner and when i came back he was gone.
Posted by: pumabot | July 21, 2008 at 11:31 PM
Kevin- post it again!!!! lol
Also, did you see you were linked on PM?
Posted by: Christina | July 21, 2008 at 11:32 PM
Christina,
Based on your definition of trolling, I'd have to say that I'm no troll at this site.
First, I think this site is great and I love what you're doing. I wish you were better suited for the task, but nothing's perfect.
Second, based on the number of comments that are dedicated to responding to the comments I posted here, my comments hardly seem irrelevant (though you all have been attacking me more than the content of what I posted in comments).
As for dividing the Democratic Party, the failed leaders have done that. Did you read our response to the Fowler-Germond letter?
The last time the Democratic Party has fielded a candidate who was qualified for the office AND who actually won was in 1996.
Though I supported only one candidate enthusiastically since 1996, I have voted the party line year after year because I believe that, even though it is often led badly, the Democratic Party is right on the issues.
I voted for Gore in 2000. I voted against the 2003 recall of Gov. Davis in California. And I voted for Kerry in 2004 (I even donated money to the DNC that year).
I voted each time unenthusiastically, and they all lost.
In 2006, I supported Harold Ford, Jr. for U.S. Senator from TN very enthusiastically. I met him, had my picture taken with him, and donated money to his campaign. Still, he lost.
That year, I wrote to Howard Dean and the DNC to tell them what the Republicans in Tennessee were doing to him, the horrible smear campaign, by the Democratic Party leadership did nothing, and Ford lost.
I'm sorry, but the Democratic Party leadership has failed to represent our interests well for far too long. Now they've failed to stand up for our core democratic principles. It's too much. They have to go.
Attack me personally all you like. I'm not stopping. Not this time.
Posted by: Knoxville | July 22, 2008 at 01:36 AM
NOBODY gave to Hillary Clinton in June because the name Barack Obama was on her website. In the meantime, please join the PostCard Movement.
I assume this "war" between Taylor and Will must have something to do with Taylor's "plummeting" ratings after bailing on Hillary. That is the real story.
http://www.PROTEST-POSTCARDS.com
http://www.POSTCARD-BRIGADE.com
http://www.HILLARY-WINS.com
http://www.CAUCUSCHEATING.com
http://www.FAIR-REFLECTION.com
Posted by: Alessandro Machi | July 22, 2008 at 01:37 AM
NOBODY gave to Hillary Clinton in June because the name Barack Obama was on her website. In the meantime, please join the PostCard Movement.
I assume this "war" between Taylor and Will must have something to do with Taylor's "plummeting" ratings after bailing on Hillary. That is the real story.
http://www.PROTEST-POSTCARDS.com
http://www.POSTCARD-BRIGADE.com
http://www.HILLARY-WINS.com
http://www.CAUCUSCHEATING.com
http://www.FAIR-REFLECTION.com
Posted by: Alessandro Machi | July 22, 2008 at 01:37 AM
So not only did the PUMAs lie about that "$10 million raised", (no surprise), but now instead of "Rise Hillary Rise", it's more and more looking like the PUMA mantra is "Throw the bitch under the bus" when it comes to Sen. Clinton.
I expected it would. It was, despite their pity party claims, never about Sen. Clinton losing the nomination. It was about the hatred for Sen. Obama. Nothing else.
How else can they believe the constant stream of lies, myths, and distortions they spew. Now myth too out there, no slander too great. From allegations of fake birth certificates, to being a stealth Muslim with a crazy Christian pastor. From video tapes that will show up "any day now, no, really, we mean it this time", to wanted con-men claiming gay sex.
Not to mention the "support all women, unless they're that crazy Obama bitch" thing.
The DNC complaints are just the latest cover for what it really is. Blind hatred.
Posted by: Patrick McKinnion | July 22, 2008 at 02:52 AM
(Your comments from the Taylor Marsh website)
... But I also don't want someone who would have donated to not donate because Bowers is on the news pontificating something that may very well not be true.
Christina | Homepage | 07.21.2008 - 10:48 pm |
________________________________________________
I read your blogpost on the Taylor Marsh site today. Your post was not entirely honest. Of course, it was full of YOUR opinion, and speculation. Your speculative comment above is a case in point. You presented material as if it were true in your blogpost, but then in the comments section of the TM site, you typed the comments above. To me, your comments are an admission that you have no idea how much money was raised which contradicts certain parts of your actual blogpost.
The figures you quote for the Hillary campaign donations are in line with what I have read on other websites for the month of June. As I have seen written here by someone else in the comments section of your blog, a push was made to pay off Hillary's debt in the beginning of July. Those results will not be known until, I believe, the third week in August.
As for your comment about contacting the Hillary campaign insider to determine the extent of donations made on behalf of the different PUMA groups, do you realize that the donations were from individuals like myself who went to the Hillary webpage to make the donations, and not made as group donations? You comment about "Puma Headers" was also specious. Heidi Li had long ago maxed out her donations to the Hillary campaign. She has also donated money to many other worthy causes during this election cycle, including the Taylor Marsh website. Why would you post comments as truth when you obviously did not know how much Heidi Li has donated in the past? There is still a maximum donation of $2300.00 dollars per individual for the primary that cannot be surpassed. I am sure that you realize this. Is it not possible that the "PUMA Headers", as you refer to them, have already maxed out their donations? Your comment about their lack of donations was unfair, and especially disrespectful to a person like Heidi Li who has done much to promote Hillary Clinton. Your snide comments might have seemed clever to you, but all you did was make anyone who knows better pissed off, and also make yourself look like a bit of a fool. Although you obviously have a talent for writing, your thread was shoddy writing.
Your accusation in your article that people are sending Hillary dollars to her is plain stupid, uninformed, and not true. Your comment showed that you did not know what you were writing about when it came to the fake money. The money was created to send to the DNC. I have yet to see anyone indicate that they intended to send the fake money to the Hillary campaign.
As for Obama's attempts to get his supporters to raise money on Hillary's behalf, the last figure I read was that his supporters have donated a grand total of $80,000.00 dollars. Now since that was about a week ago, I'll assume that this figure is a bit more. Wow, how generous, don't you think? Not.
Additionally, your comment about Darragh Murphy was also a bit disingenuous when you consider that both Markos Moulitsas from DailyKos and Arianna Huffington from the Huffington Post are also former Republicans, but are now suspiciously the darlings of most progressives. Even Taylor Marsh was a Reagan Democrat! So when you imply that someone is not a true Democrat based on past party affiliation, that is very unfair of you.
I apologize for the tone in much of this comment, but I don't like to read threads that are not honest or correct for that matter, and since I can no longer comment on Taylor's blog, I decided to go directly to the source.
I may not support Obama, but I am a Democrat through and through. I am of the opinion that Obama and many of his supporters are the "faux Democrats". Do you not realize that it was the Hillary Clinton campaign that garnered the majority of the Democratic base voters in the primaries? She kept most of the Democratic base in tact. Obama's support was not predominately the Democratic base. Articles like what you posted on the Taylor Marsh site do nothing to accomplish the goal of unity. Not that it matters anyway. Most people have already made their decisions, although my feeling is that some people will change their minds before the general election. I am not one of them.
As for Knoxville, keep standing up for what you believe. These people do not like the fact that people are not bowing to the "masters" at the DNC. As for trying to pit Hillary against us, what's the point. She is doing what she has to do, and we decided long before Hillary suspended her campaign, that we would not be supporting Obama if he is the nominee. I don't reward what I consider to be bad behavior. For anyone to say that voting against Obama is a misdirected attempt to get back at the DNC is laughable. It is the BEST way to send a message to the DNC, and to the Obama campaign, especially when one believes that the nomination process was flawed, with cheating in Iowa, Texas, Indiana, and possibly other states, bullying at caucuses, false racism accusations against the Clintons that went unanswered by the DNC, and DNC shenanigans in general that were detrimental to Hillary's campaign. If I felt that the primaries were completely fair, then I would not have any problem supporting the putative Democratic nominee. But fairness flew out the window from the first voting in Iowa. (Search the internet for stories about this because there were reports from both the Edwards campaign and the Clinton campaign. Polls before the vote there also did not coincide with the actual vote. Go figure.) We will remember in November.
Posted by: Nomobama | July 22, 2008 at 03:17 AM
How amusing, established idiots like Knoxville and Nomobama come here and try to come off as reasonable and rational, and they still fail.
Go comment back to the other klansmen at No Quarter, guys. Nobody here gives a damn what you two think. No amount of explanation is going to get your credibility back.
No matter how hard you try, you fail. And you movement will lose.
Posted by: Pumalicious! | July 22, 2008 at 08:52 AM
First, my post about PUMAs is all TRUE.
If these donations were from individual donors then this campaign insider was correct: There is no way to track them all and Will Bowers has NO business saying that raising this much money is
because of his group.
We should be able to agree to that much, but I doubt it.
Actually, you're wrong. If you go to TM's site and read that article again, I never say that the money wasn't raised. I link to an article of a Hillary campaign insider saying that it's a fallacy.
I said we would have to wait until August to see how much money was raised.
I know all of the donations that Heidi Li gave. I looked her up on on the FEC page. That is the same woman donating to her own organization in order to make up the difference and reach her fundraising goals for The Denver Group, correct?
My assessment of Heidi Li is why I, and many others believe that she has become the pocket book to PUMA, "look at all the money heidi li gave. go look! look at her!"
"... especially when one believes that the nomination process was flawed, with cheating in Iowa, Texas, Indiana, and possibly other states, bullying at caucuses, false racism accusations against the Clintons that went unanswered by the DNC, and DNC shenanigans in general that were detrimental to Hillary's campaign."
I don't believe that the nomination process was flawed. Caucuses have been around long before Senator Obama and both candidate knew how these work. There is no proof of cheating, only claims by PUMAs who frankly, as of late, have less and less credibility.
Sorry you didn't like my blog post. Sometimes reality is hard to hear. But the fact remains the same- Will Bowers is lying, and I will believe a campaign insider over Will Bowers ANY day.
Posted by: Christina | July 22, 2008 at 09:00 AM
Will Bower and Fox News:
http://www.newshounds.us/2008/07/21/obama_haters_always_welcome_on_fox_even_if_they_say_one_thing_one_day_and_another_thing_the_next.php
Two lying liars and the lies they lie about.
Posted by: Pumalicious! | July 22, 2008 at 09:22 AM
As for Obama's attempts to get his supporters to raise money on Hillary's behalf, the last figure I read was that his supporters have donated a grand total of $80,000.00 dollars. Now since that was about a week ago, I'll assume that this figure is a bit more. Wow, how generous, don't you think? Not.
Yes, I do think. Considering that she is a multi-millionaire and that his supporters are focused on beating McSame I'd say even $8.00 would count as very generous.
Posted by: Lawnguylander | July 22, 2008 at 01:12 PM
This in from Open Secrets:
http://www.opensecrets.org/pres08/summary.php?cycle=2008&cid=N00000019
Hillary Clinton (D)
Cash on Hand: $26,046,667
Debts: $25,201,723
Posted by: Will Bower | July 22, 2008 at 01:53 PM
Maybe he's cracking under the pressure?
Posted by: Wendy~Dem4life | July 22, 2008 at 02:20 PM
"I don't believe that the nomination process was flawed. Caucuses have been around long before Senator Obama and both candidate knew how these work. There is no proof of cheating, only claims by PUMAs who frankly, as of late, have less and less credibility."
You have to understand the logic here.
Sen. Clinton lost.
Therefore the process was flawed.
PUMA logic. Of course, PUMA seems to be throwing Sen. Clinton under the bus now that she's denouncing them and supporting Sen. Obama....
Posted by: Patrick McKinnion | July 22, 2008 at 04:52 PM
Nice Patrick lol. We like to refer to them as "PUfacts!"
Posted by: Christina | July 22, 2008 at 05:59 PM
Your story title is misleading if "you never said that the money was not raised". Your title is implying that the PUMA effort to raise money for Hillary failed. The different PUMA aligned groups were the one's advancing and supporting the effort to pay down Hillary's debt during the July 4th holiday. If we see a spike in donations during this time period, then it is fair to attribute much of the success to the PUMA groups.
As for Pumalicious, it is you that has a lock on being brainless... typical name caller with very little to say. You probably get off on behaving that way. Whatever floats your boat as I have seen this type of behavior throughout the primaries.
Posted by: nomobama | July 22, 2008 at 07:39 PM
My comments about a flawed primary system are written with the hope and expectation that the system is changed FOR FUTURE PRIMARIES as I believed that the current system is flawed. There is nothing in my previous post to indicate that the current primary/caucus votes should be changed in any way. Due to the closeness of the primary race, the flaws were brought to light. Caucuses are indeed a less fair way to choose a candidate. In my opinion, all states should have primaries spread throughout the primary season. There would be no doubt about voter intentions when there is a one person/one vote type of voting system as done in a primary vote. Was that so difficult for you all to grasp?
Posted by: nomobama | July 22, 2008 at 07:46 PM
Why is it fair to attribute anything to PUMA??
Let's put it this way, spread this note- if Hillary releases her papers next month and there is a spike in monetary donations but nothing says PUMA or PUMApac, then it's fair to say lots of people donated- not PUMA.
Posted by: Christina | July 22, 2008 at 07:49 PM